- [2016-04-10 19:01:13] Welcome to the monthly meeting of DCNF, it's 2016-04-10 (postponed from 2016-04-03). - [2016-04-10 19:01:19] I might Pretorian if you bring up some ideas but I can't see the manpower here and the willingness there on the Air camp to do the actual work on the topic - [2016-04-10 19:01:23] For simplicity sake, I will be the chairman and Crise has agreed to act as secretary (regardless if he's currently here). - [2016-04-10 19:01:34] What we do need is a head count, so just state your names. - [2016-04-10 19:01:36] Pretorian - [2016-04-10 19:01:41] eMTee - [2016-04-10 19:01:46] cologic - [2016-04-10 19:01:47] poy - [2016-04-10 19:01:53] All right, let's continue. - [2016-04-10 19:02:14] There's a few items from the last meeting; * Email to EFF and potentially discuss response, if any (Pretorian) * GitLab.com accounts (Crise) * HTTPS management (reacquiring certificates, cologic/Crise) * Chat commands on the organization’s DC hub (+about and +rules, poy/Pretorian) * Tax papers for 2015 continued, get English documents if they exist (Pretorian) * Suggestions for internetfonden.se projects (Everyone) - [2016-04-10 19:02:26] We'll deal with additional things after these. - [2016-04-10 19:02:45] * E-mail to EFF; - [2016-04-10 19:02:48] thew meeting is here? - [2016-04-10 19:02:48] Here's the response I got - [2016-04-10 19:02:51] Yeah - [2016-04-10 19:02:56] Hi Fredrik, Thanks for writing to us. The EFF white paper you posted relates to US copyright law. And I think A and B are addressed by that whitepaper. I think the first step for you to do would be to get advice from a Swedish attorney/organization about your concerns. If our Swedish attorney(s) deem that you need to speak with attorneys in other jurisdictions, we would be happy to see what kind of help we can offer in terms of US copyright law. Lastly, in terms of the license of the software, I'd recommend contacting the Software Freedom Law Center as they advise a lot of FOSS projects on licensing issues. Best regards, Electronic Frontier Foundation (415) 436-9333 info@eff.org Become a Member! https://www.eff.org/support - [2016-04-10 19:03:19] So basically EFF said "just look at our document and get in contact with an attorney for the rest". - [2016-04-10 19:03:49] which pops up the question what is EFF really for then - [2016-04-10 19:03:50] I have also mailed Swedish Pirate Party, awaiting their response. They might have insight into Swedish law and are knowledgable about the filesharing scene. - [2016-04-10 19:03:59] eMTee: Yeah, I agree. - [2016-04-10 19:04:04] maybe not for what you thought - [2016-04-10 19:04:30] eMTee: one major function in the US is that they handle precendent-creating test cases in digital law in the US. - [2016-04-10 19:04:53] The Swedish text is basically a translation of the mail, I will put both up on the forum later on today. - [2016-04-10 19:05:09] Also, to track and publicize related legislation. - [2016-04-10 19:05:15] (I understand that people can't read Swedish but for transparency sake.) - [2016-04-10 19:05:46] correction, most people... - [2016-04-10 19:05:55] Hehe, sneaky devil - [2016-04-10 19:06:10] So we will have to find other ways to approach legal issues. - [2016-04-10 19:06:27] I don't have any good suggestions apart form straight up mailing some "free" attorneys. - [2016-04-10 19:06:53] given the amount of high-profile US-based FOSS orgs, people are probably far more knowledgeable on US specifics than other countries. it's probably wise, indeed, to ask Swedes first. - [2016-04-10 19:07:20] Practically, it's not clear how often the circumstances discussed are going to come up regarding some of the semi-affiliated projects. - [2016-04-10 19:07:21] If there are any EU places, I suppose that takes precedence. - [2016-04-10 19:07:44] there may also be other people able to help than the EFF; worth researching? - [2016-04-10 19:07:56] Yeah. I urge people to think of ways/places to call/mail. - [2016-04-10 19:08:15] I don't know if there's a "Swedish free call center" for these sort of things... - [2016-04-10 19:08:19] Doubt it... - [2016-04-10 19:08:29] Justice Department? Unlikely, I suppose... - [2016-04-10 19:09:02] Anyway, I don't have anything additional to say regarding this, apart from just urging people to think of/research ways. - [2016-04-10 19:09:08] the thing is, no one will provide us with definitive answers on these tricky questions. and it's risky to head off with the org without definitive answers. - [2016-04-10 19:09:19] poy: that's fair. - [2016-04-10 19:10:07] well, most attorneys like their paychecks... so can't really expect the moon here - [2016-04-10 19:10:13] if we are willing to take a little risk, let's just get guidance here and there and start it. - [2016-04-10 19:10:45] I think we should be fairly conservative, per EFF's paper, and cautiously move forward. - [2016-04-10 19:10:56] We shouldn't get "stuck" on this, IMO. - [2016-04-10 19:11:29] I agree - [2016-04-10 19:11:35] Is there anything, specifically, that would otherwise be happening, but for these legal questions? - [2016-04-10 19:11:52] The EU court also ruled that one can't be convicted of accessory to a copyright crime, if one takes appropriate measures. - [2016-04-10 19:12:18] Are these "appropriate measures" akin to those suggested by the EFF? - [2016-04-10 19:12:22] (At least what I read from TorrentFreak) - [2016-04-10 19:12:24] Yeah - [2016-04-10 19:12:24] almost everything we want the DCNF to provide. can't provide that if we don't know which projects can be taken in. - [2016-04-10 19:12:52] - [2016-04-10 19:13:15] EU at least. - [2016-04-10 19:14:18] So I propose we move forward with deciding which type of projects we take in/do, and keep a close eye on any potential legal issues. - [2016-04-10 19:14:24] maybe we could prepare some "entry form" projects have to adhere to? - [2016-04-10 19:14:28] That's a useful ruling to have, though as "The Advocate General’s advice is not binding, but the European Court of Justice often uses such advice as the basis of its rulings." alludes to, non-common-law systems aren't the same to reason about as common-law systems. - [2016-04-10 19:14:32] Yeah, that's a good idea, poy. - [2016-04-10 19:14:43] poy: I'll build a draft. - [2016-04-10 19:15:07] cologic: Right, but still useful for the org nontheless. - [2016-04-10 19:15:36] Quite, yes. - [2016-04-10 19:16:17] So; to move forward; an entry form shall be created (Pretorian) and everyone shall keep an eye out for potential approaches to attain more legal information. - [2016-04-10 19:16:24] since we likely won't get any extensive legal advice here, let's go with best effort. forms to sign by projects, etc. - [2016-04-10 19:16:31] Yeah - [2016-04-10 19:17:30] Unless people have additional things to add (we could talk about this at lengths, but I know people don't have hours and hours at their disposal), I propose we pick the next topic. - [2016-04-10 19:17:57] (Let me know if I'm "too hasty".) - [2016-04-10 19:18:06] fine by me. :) - [2016-04-10 19:18:09]  GitLab.com accounts (Crise) - [2016-04-10 19:18:17] Crise: How has it gone with them? - [2016-04-10 19:18:44] Have you set up anything? - [2016-04-10 19:20:33] skip until Crise is back? - [2016-04-10 19:20:35] Yeah - [2016-04-10 19:20:42] * HTTPS management - [2016-04-10 19:20:55] cologic: You re-acquired the certificates? - [2016-04-10 19:21:04] cologic: What is left of HTTPS? - [2016-04-10 19:21:08] Yes, and I've streamlined the process since last month. - [2016-04-10 19:21:20] It handles certain failure conditions better. - [2016-04-10 19:21:44] (It doesn't just repeat indefinitely, and is more careful about running out of Let's Encrypt's per-time-period quota.) - [2016-04-10 19:21:48] Ok, so we are "done" with HTTPS? - [2016-04-10 19:22:05] More or less. It will never be totally "done", but it's asymptotically done, yes. - [2016-04-10 19:22:38] Wait, we have one thing left. I'd like you to write an article at the blog where you describe all of your tests, and provide the cron script etc. - [2016-04-10 19:22:44] So other projects can also do this. - [2016-04-10 19:22:55] Sure, seems useful to document. - [2016-04-10 19:23:03] I know one can just say "look at Let's Encrypt's website", but that doesn't cover the script etc. - [2016-04-10 19:23:20] Yeah, and a lot of the guides are about the letsencrypt-auto client, the official one. - [2016-04-10 19:23:30] Which has real tradeoffs which many people are unhappy with. - [2016-04-10 19:23:39] So this would provide an alternative. - [2016-04-10 19:23:42] Yeah. - [2016-04-10 19:23:59] All right. Let's continue. - [2016-04-10 19:24:00] Also, the crypto choices. - [2016-04-10 19:24:06] * Chat commands on the organization’s DC hub - [2016-04-10 19:24:16] poy: This is done, right? Order etc is correct now, AFAIK. - [2016-04-10 19:24:26] made a proper script, included in the ADCH++ repo, yep. ) - [2016-04-10 19:25:07] Great. - [2016-04-10 19:25:13] Let's continue. - [2016-04-10 19:25:20] * Tax papers for 2015 continued - [2016-04-10 19:25:29] Like I wrote in my mail; - [2016-04-10 19:25:30] Tax papers do not exist in English, my translation exist; and The form seems reasonably straightforward, at least as much as any tax form can be. - [2016-04-10 19:26:37] Actually, I'm impressed how few 'tangents' it goes on (how many special cases it spends pages making sure are handled properly.) - [2016-04-10 19:27:03] Basically I suggest the "type of organization" as "Utbildning [Education]", or "Annan likvärding verksamhet [Other equal ventures/operations]"] as "Infrastructure on the Internet". - [2016-04-10 19:27:39] Swedish_input is basically everything filled in except the member fees etc. - [2016-04-10 19:27:55] (because I haven't checked them for the exact number for 2015) - [2016-04-10 19:27:59] Makes as much sense as anything else and more than most of the options. As we've discussed, none of the choices matches perfectly, but that's about as close as it gets. - [2016-04-10 19:28:24] I know that lots of government organizations love "infrastructural projects". - [2016-04-10 19:28:32] Given the prevalence of real-estate-orgnization-choices, etc that these tax forms provide. - [2016-04-10 19:29:06] If anyone wants additional things to be translated/or think the current translation is poor/don't understand the translation, just let me know and I'll try and fix it. - [2016-04-10 19:29:18] It's how governments 'save for the future'. Unless they're Norway, or similarly small+wealthy, but, well. - [2016-04-10 19:29:31] I will see what I can do with merging the document with translation, don't know if it's possible. - [2016-04-10 19:30:00] I don't have anything else to add on this topic, unless others want to comment. - [2016-04-10 19:30:06] (People can read the docs) - [2016-04-10 19:30:30] Let's continue. - [2016-04-10 19:30:45] * Suggestions for internetfonden.se projects - [2016-04-10 19:31:03] Internetfonden.se project proposals (cost around 300k SEK maximum). People should come up with their own suggestions. No need to "vote" on what people think is best, it's just to get a feel for what could be possible * Build mobile app * Build browser-addons with DC backbone * Build architecture for e.g. game publishers to transfer files (peer-to-peer) based on DC backbone (similar to how World Of Warcraft uses Bittorrent to transfer updates etc). - [2016-04-10 19:31:08] (what I wrote in my mail) - [2016-04-10 19:31:26] what did I miss? - [2016-04-10 19:31:37] * Web app (different than browser addon or mobile app; accessible in some different circumstances) - [2016-04-10 19:31:51] Crise: Do +history, you have an outstanding topic of Github - [2016-04-10 19:32:08] sure, sorry about that... - [2016-04-10 19:32:23] cologic: AirDC++ people have done this already, at least partially. The issue would be to improve it/make it general. - [2016-04-10 19:32:23] protocol-related ideas? - [2016-04-10 19:32:30] poy: Doesn't matter. Anything at all. - [2016-04-10 19:32:41] history seems to be broken - [2016-04-10 19:32:51] * ADC as exemplar of semi-decentralized, encrypted infrastructure for chat which doesn't rely on single points of failure and for which (Slack, Hipchat, etc) there's evident demand for the idea in general. - [2016-04-10 19:32:56] Basically Internetfondon might give us money to create a paid project. - [2016-04-10 19:33:19] Crise: See PM - [2016-04-10 19:33:49] cologic: I think klondike was looking into something related, IIRC. - [2016-04-10 19:33:57] * Put a decentralized hub listing mechanism into place - [2016-04-10 19:34:20] Conveniently, ADC has much better UTF8 support than IRC, too, so it can even do emojis, etc. - [2016-04-10 19:34:27] +1 on poy's idea.... - [2016-04-10 19:34:52] * ADC bridges with IRC / Slack / etc - [2016-04-10 19:34:53] Yes, poy hits on something important here, and for which funding would help. - [2016-04-10 19:35:15] Decentralized hub listing, isn't that just DFAV? - [2016-04-10 19:35:28] "just" - [2016-04-10 19:35:53] that is one possibility Pretorian; the actual implementation is lacking. ;) - [2016-04-10 19:35:59] as for the web thing, what airdc has done while impressive is esentially a client program with a ui that runs in web browser (think mldonkey), not useful as a web service per se - [2016-04-10 19:36:13] poy: Fair enough :) - [2016-04-10 19:36:27] DFAV is also "small scale" as I understand it... - [2016-04-10 19:36:41] Also, there would need to be some kind of bootstrapping for people who haven't already started using DC's hubs. - [2016-04-10 19:37:19] * Bridge Bittorrent and DC applications via magnet links - [2016-04-10 19:37:28] (magnet.exe etc) - [2016-04-10 19:37:32] Crise: one could imagine, e.g., a chat version, too, which didn't make sense for mldonkey, but for which there's obvious utility with more IRC-like systems. - [2016-04-10 19:38:22] Requirements; Use Google translate and ask if there's anything you have questions about. - [2016-04-10 19:38:36] Whoops, even 399k SEK. - [2016-04-10 19:39:03] AFAIK, we pass all requirements. - [2016-04-10 19:39:29] So after we have an idea, the next thing would be to think of ways of actually accomplishing it (who shall implement it etc). - [2016-04-10 19:39:32] did anyone ever bring up GSoC, I mean I have nothing against sweden, but it would be nice to be able to operate in english :P - [2016-04-10 19:39:39] GSoC? - [2016-04-10 19:39:54] ? - [2016-04-10 19:40:03] That's fine of course as well. - [2016-04-10 19:40:26] I'm just not sure if Google can provide funding. - [2016-04-10 19:41:15] AFAIK GSoC focuses on improving extant open-source projects, which is a different frame. - [2016-04-10 19:41:18] Internetfonden don't really have a requirement for Swedish, just that the basic website is in Swedish. - [2016-04-10 19:41:34] fair enough - [2016-04-10 19:41:41] Internetfonden seems to focus more on freestanding projects which might be attached to existing projects, or maybe not. - [2016-04-10 19:41:49] I'm not sure which works better here. - [2016-04-10 19:41:55] We can do both, I suppose. - [2016-04-10 19:42:04] assuming we have the people to do it. - [2016-04-10 19:42:16] And it's possible to get "outside" help as well. - [2016-04-10 19:42:55] 400k SEK is basically 3 months worth of developer time. - [2016-04-10 19:42:59] (one developer) - [2016-04-10 19:43:29] Rough estimate: cost 800 SEK/hour * 172 hours in a month. - [2016-04-10 19:43:55] (Some cost 600 SEK/hour and some 1000.) - [2016-04-10 19:44:08] We can pay someone here/on DC as well. - [2016-04-10 19:44:11] Of course. - [2016-04-10 19:44:32] Crise: So, how about Github? - [2016-04-10 19:44:37] Ehm, sorry. - [2016-04-10 19:44:40] Let's continue I mean. - [2016-04-10 19:44:49] Unless others have additional things to add. - [2016-04-10 19:45:01] At which point, Crise, regarding Github? - [2016-04-10 19:46:14] ... - [2016-04-10 19:46:29] Bad connection? - [2016-04-10 19:46:43] slow typer - [2016-04-10 19:46:46] Ah, sorry. - [2016-04-10 19:46:51] and sick, so excuse me :) - [2016-04-10 19:47:31] Well, for starters... we talked about GitLab not GitHub, but at the end of the day either SaaS provider works for me (although private repositories on GitLab.com are free where as organization account on GitHub with private repositories goes for a premium) - [2016-04-10 19:49:38] I did create accounts on the former, https://gitlab.com/groups/dcnf haven't had much a chance to do anything with it yet... the website needs a little work before versioning it makes sense namely use SSI or anything at hand to remove all that duplicate markup - [2016-04-10 19:50:38] I mean the more content is added the more overwhelming keeping all the pages consistent will become - [2016-04-10 19:51:56] So we can't just dump e.g. meetings/ or resources/ there? - [2016-04-10 19:52:59] we can, but if we intend to expand the content on the site it makes sense to make the identical portions of each page to pull from one place instead of being duplicated - [2016-04-10 19:54:28] This is the sort of problem rsync, etc is designed to solve. - [2016-04-10 19:54:46] no, not really - [2016-04-10 19:54:59] cologic: No, each page is copy/pasted HTML code. - [2016-04-10 19:55:07] Ah, right. - [2016-04-10 19:55:07] there's no CSS/main file etc. - [2016-04-10 19:55:14] I am talking about how you copy the boilerplate html into each document when you make a page - [2016-04-10 19:55:29] I misunderstood, yeah. - [2016-04-10 19:55:35] I do see your concern. - [2016-04-10 19:56:06] Crise: How about we now move all files (in terms of .doc or .pdf) and we have a future action for the site/HTML itself? - [2016-04-10 19:56:35] So we do a partial move at this time. - [2016-04-10 19:57:37] That seems like a good intermediate step, I had hoped I would have had time to work on the site and address the issue of boilerplate code... unfortunately I didn't foresee getting sick this Friday - [2016-04-10 20:00:13] All right, let's focus on the files and look into the site later on. - [2016-04-10 20:01:20] I mean nothing stops us from dumping the html files into the version control as is, however, it is not very neat... and I like things neat - [2016-04-10 20:02:10] All right, let's continue. - [2016-04-10 20:02:38] We've covered all items from the last meeting, so people can now state what additional items they want to bring up - [2016-04-10 20:02:45] * Pretorian-1: We have previously, but briefly, discussed which types of projects we should do. One project I'd like to address is how we could possibly merge or "bring together" various mods, e.g. DC++ with AirDC++. One such approach is through plugins. * Pretorian-2: In Sweden it is possible to obtain a "publishing license", basically as newspapers have. This is called "Ansvarig utgivare" or "reponsible publisher". This would provide additional legal protection for reporting on or talking about issues. - [2016-04-10 20:03:13] (I'll let a few minutes pass until we address them, so people will have time to write their own discussion items.) - [2016-04-10 20:06:04] Ok, I guess no one has additional items (feel free to add while we're discussing other items). - [2016-04-10 20:06:08] * Pretorian-1: - [2016-04-10 20:06:22] Basically I want to see what we can do to bridge the gap between various clients. - [2016-04-10 20:07:22] different goals, for different users... why try to "merge" them? - [2016-04-10 20:07:31] diversity is good. ) - [2016-04-10 20:07:34] The most appropriate way of doing so is through plugins, and I think DCNF in such case should provide the necessary infrastructure. - [2016-04-10 20:08:07] The problem is that in DC, mainly thanks to arne's policy of promoting diversity through separate client projects doing it retroactively could be hard - [2016-04-10 20:08:17] Well, the issue is when some clients have active developers and some don't. - [2016-04-10 20:08:31] the DC++ project maybe, not the DCNF (unless it assumes DC++ is its "official" client, which is not the case). - [2016-04-10 20:08:57] Right, DC++ is not the main project, it was simply an example. - [2016-04-10 20:09:20] It might be the case that users want functionality X from client A and functionality Y from client B. - [2016-04-10 20:09:28] that's also the life of a project: sometimes active, sometimes not... - [2016-04-10 20:09:29] poy: can we please not talk technicalities... we all know what is the main driving force of any DC development, whether officially affiliated or not - [2016-04-10 20:09:57] I don't mean we should come up with exact solutions, I just want to have a discussion. - [2016-04-10 20:10:17] One such way is to provide a robust infrastructure for e.g. plugins. - [2016-04-10 20:10:27] Extending the plugin framework to do much more. - [2016-04-10 20:10:38] And providing searchable plugins etc. - [2016-04-10 20:11:04] that sounds good; after all, the plugins aren't designed to fit into a single client. - [2016-04-10 20:11:15] I can definitely see Pretorian's point here... because lot of people are running outdated obsolete client programs for the sake of one specific feature - [2016-04-10 20:11:24] Crise: Indeed. - [2016-04-10 20:12:24] once the DCNF moves further with hosting projects / etc, the website could list possibilities, "activity", contributors, features of each program... - [2016-04-10 20:13:05] poy: While noble, the issue with all such pages is having it updated (by someone). - [2016-04-10 20:13:29] I suppose we can have a standing action for each DCNF meeting to keep it updated. - [2016-04-10 20:14:09] good idea. ^^ and if the DCNF is useful enough, projects might update their page themselves too... - [2016-04-10 20:14:43] What other ways can people think of where we can "bridge the gap" between clients? - [2016-04-10 20:14:48] question poy: as a DC++ developer, what would make DCNF useful enough for DC++ - [2016-04-10 20:15:26] Crise: that's a good question that should be posed to all developers (even those not working with DCNF at the moment). - [2016-04-10 20:15:41] hosting - web site, code repo and the like; legal framework; then everything else the DCNF provides (communication...). - [2016-04-10 20:16:38] so basically DC specific SourceForge then, huh... we have a lot of work to do :) - [2016-04-10 20:16:49] Crise: Indeed :) - [2016-04-10 20:16:50] a central point where you get all your DC-related updates... sort of what Toast had tried to build at one point... - [2016-04-10 20:17:30] there are forge / code hosting projects around; not necessarily that hard. ;) - [2016-04-10 20:17:40] the problem with even something as simple as code repositories, project X likes git, project Y mercurial, project Z something else - [2016-04-10 20:17:45] I think a major point is having some portions of the DCNF website be accessable by project developers or automated enough, so that DCNF itself doesn't have to update things. - [2016-04-10 20:18:38] E.g., I may not necessarily care about project X's latest version, but it should be pulled automatically (or at least semi-automatically) via RSS and the like. - [2016-04-10 20:19:11] we first have to accept some projects in and we'll see what suits each the better and how to harmonize all that... - [2016-04-10 20:20:09] Let's ponder these things more and continue. - [2016-04-10 20:20:20] * Pretorian-2: In Sweden it is possible to obtain a "publishing license", basically as newspapers have. This is called "Ansvarig utgivare" or "reponsible publisher". This would provide additional legal protection for reporting on or talking about issues. - [2016-04-10 20:20:40] well, as long as everyone involved remembers that we have one, that is 1, server in terms of resources at the moment... - [2016-04-10 20:20:48] Basically, this is a way for newspapers to be able to say/write pretty much anything they want as long as they are not saying anything illegal. - [2016-04-10 20:20:54] didn't answer your #1 topic much but I think it's too early for the DCNF since it doesn't host any project yet; but a discussion to be had outside of a DCNF context for now, sure. - [2016-04-10 20:21:42] Basically publisher is so that the organization gains Swedish constitutional rights, if it doesn't already have them. - [2016-04-10 20:21:59] the publishing license sounds good; anything required from the org aside from just asking for it? - [2016-04-10 20:22:09] There is a single requirement that is of interest; the org must publish 4 papers/books per year. - [2016-04-10 20:22:14] (or, rather, "issues" - [2016-04-10 20:22:30] do blog articles count? :D - [2016-04-10 20:22:34] has lots of information. - [2016-04-10 20:22:37] define: paper? - [2016-04-10 20:22:54] Blog articles _may_ count. - [2016-04-10 20:23:27] would something like the meeting protocol notes count? - [2016-04-10 20:23:35] Basically if you publish e.g. "Direct Connect: The State of the network" (must be the same title/issue name) one every 3 month, we're good. - [2016-04-10 20:23:38] No. - [2016-04-10 20:24:30] What we can do is publish a blog article that keeps the same name (apart from issue number). - [2016-04-10 20:24:37] so it has to qualify as a publication then, judging from that... - [2016-04-10 20:24:46] Yes. - [2016-04-10 20:25:09] It _can_ be "this is what DCNF has done these last 3 months". - [2016-04-10 20:25:18] (off for an hour, sorry.) - [2016-04-10 20:25:36] There's no length requirements, but likely at least 5-6 pages worth of content. - [2016-04-10 20:26:14] as long as the board secretary is not responsible for producing that content... go for it :P - [2016-04-10 20:26:19] (Still watching. Just haven't had things to comment on.) - [2016-04-10 20:26:27] heh, right, there's no requirement for that. - [2016-04-10 20:27:00] What I'd like for people do to is to go through the links above and til the next meeting have comments/ideas for the _type_ of article/book/issue. - [2016-04-10 20:27:38] The publishing license comes with a cost (200 €), so it's not something we do willy-nilly. - [2016-04-10 20:28:02] But I want people to think of it at least, as a possible way of being able to publish certain content that we may not otherwise be able to. - [2016-04-10 20:28:22] E.g., it may or may not be permissable for us to publish comments on the court cases under /resources. - [2016-04-10 20:29:00] We should be able to publish the court cases themselves without problems (as we do now), just that I'm unsure of the legal possibilities of commenting on them (whether the technical aspects are correct etc). - [2016-04-10 20:29:19] (FWIW, I've read most of them and they are technically "ok".) - [2016-04-10 20:29:54] Obviously we can't comment on the legality of X but we should be able to say "this is not possible/this is easy to do/find out in DC" etc. - [2016-04-10 20:30:18] And obviously, not supporting potential copyright infringement*. - [2016-04-10 20:30:20] Well, it's common for lawyers not to be able to do that. - [2016-04-10 20:30:44] Thus all the IAMAL sorts of disclaimers -- actual lawyers in the US often can't comment publicly. - [2016-04-10 20:30:51] *IANAL - [2016-04-10 20:31:04] I think it would essentially have to be something that talks about DC network in a more broad context... I mean actual technical stuff aside, we won't be able to produce enough content with just reporting on the organization - [2016-04-10 20:31:05] Well, an expert can say "this is an inaccurate description of X". - [2016-04-10 20:31:16] Crise: Right. - [2016-04-10 20:31:46] cologic: E.g., a gun expert would be able to comment on whether a particular bullet fits into a particular weapon or not. - [2016-04-10 20:31:58] Yeah, that's reasonable. - [2016-04-10 20:32:16] Anyway, I didn't mean to steer the conversation toward court cases specifically. - [2016-04-10 20:32:39] I want people to think of potential things for such an article/paper to include. - [2016-04-10 20:33:12] I don't have anything further for that particular discussion otherwise. - [2016-04-10 20:33:29] Does anyone have any outstanding topics? - [2016-04-10 20:33:41] well these articles and papers can only live on the assumption that there is change in DC... if DC is stagnant we are very much out of luck - [2016-04-10 20:33:51] Pretorian: I do not. - [2016-04-10 20:33:57] same - [2016-04-10 20:35:38] Items for next meeting (Crise, please re-check so I didn't miss anything); (typing) - [2016-04-10 20:38:34] * Research potential avenues for acquriing legal information (all) * Move files (non HTML) to the Gitlab site. (Crise) * Write HTTPS article. (cologic) * Tax papers - fill out and see if it's possible to merge with translation. (Pretorian) * Internetfonden - people should think of the suggestions. (all) * Research GSoC? (Pretorian/Crise/all) * Approach developers on what they want from DCNF (all) * Think of ways of providing infrastructure to plugins etc. (all) * Think of potential articles/books/issues for DCNF (all) - [2016-04-10 20:39:00] People: feel free to add actions. - [2016-04-10 20:39:28] Unless people have additional things to bring up/comment... - [2016-04-10 20:40:18] If not, then I'll guess that concludes this monthly meeting. The next meeting shall be 2016-05-01. - [2016-04-10 20:40:21] I do not. - [2016-04-10 20:41:21] I think that has everything discussed today as far as I can see. I will prepare the logs and protocol document asap, aiming for tomorrow, but I am sick so it might take a day or two more before I don't feel like shit...